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ccd:Yeah, Kirtana is the best, with mridanga. And publishing is brihad-mridanga. I can not stand shows with indian dancing and all the boring theater or pantomime things. I do not know what they attract, certainly not me.Like the Mayapuris?
manasi_seva:The mistake would be to only do a Krishna Rock and Roll band and expect that to make devotees, of course it wont.Have to agree with you there....I personally travelled for 9 years in a Hare Krsna rock band, one year we abandoned the band and we found that kirtan was 1 million times more effective - people would dance and chant instead of just sitting and watching a performance. The reason is that people in general hear rock music all the time and want something different....and of course the obvious, kirtan uses vedic instruments and ragas that invoke a more mode of goodness atmosphere and of course the Maha mantra, when chanted in this way, is very powerful.
sri_govinda_das:This interesting creative preaching stategy of srila Prabhupada's is shown in a ''wonderfully compassionate '' yet brutally honest direct preaching engagement for the benefit of siddha swarupa and his team.....Seems very expert amd quite ruthless in my humble opinion.Well... in the same way we can see Prabhupada using money collected by his disciples using criminal methods. He knew what they were doing to collect that money but he did not stop them because he needed the money for his projects. That in turn created a precedent for his disciples like Kirtanananda and Hansadutta, who later employed all kinds of abominable practices in the name of 'serving Krsna'. I'm not sure that it was an 'expert' ot 'compassionate' approach if we judge things by the results.
VEDA:Remember Tirumangai Alvar.I would venture to say that for every Tirumangai Alvar in Vaishnava history there were thousands of Kirtananandas and Hansaduttas, disgracing Vaishnavism not only with their criminality, but with their abominable personal behavior as well. Thus the rule should never be replaced with rare exceptions. The motto "End justifies the means" is not Vedic, is not Aryan, is not approved by the shastra. Invariably those who adopt that motto even with good intentions pave the way for grand abuses of power in the name of serving their cause.
sri_govinda_das:So my dear kula-pavanna das how do you deal with the instance of srila Prabhupada telling Guru-kripa swami that he and krishna had prepared a house for maharaja in the spiritual sky after he provided the laxsmi for the Vrindavan project to build ''Krishna -balarama''...,while he was traveling in New Zealand?That is between the parties in this sentence.
sri_govinda_das:They cannot appreciate collecting literally millions of dollars for srila Prabhupada,like guru-kripa swami did during his wonderful earlier years!A robber and a thief deserves proper punishment. Manu Samhita deals with that in detail and does not excuse criminals working for religious projects. That is shastra speaking. Concocting rules to justify crime in the name of higher purpose is not Aryan. It is Semitic thinking. Such concocted rules caused tremendous damage to the good name of Vaishnavism all over the world. That is a fact.
VEDA:Dharmasastras deal with the material society. However, Krsna seva is another league. This doesn't mean that I agree with crimes done by Vaisnavas but the perpetrators may get absolved sooner than we think - see HBV 11 (e.g. 326, 332-333) - and to criticize them later isn't good for us. Imho, this vicious circle of criticism is one of the main obstacles of ISKCON's progress.Yes, a Vaishnava criminal may be hanged in accordance with the earthly law, only to be pardoned by Krsna and admitted to Vaikuntha because he had the right consciousness at the time of death. These two types of justice run on paralel tracks and one can never replace the other. -------------------- While criticising (real) Vaishnavas for their criminal exploits may not be good for our spiritual life, allowing them to run unchecked can't be good to us either - both materially and spiritually. Like I said earlier, a lot of people in the world think poorly about Krsna consciousness movement because of criminal deeds comitted by certain devotees. Do you think that is without spiritual consequence? ------------------- There is no power without responsibility for actions while empowered.
sri_govinda_das:Sorry kula-pavanna.....are you calling what guru-kripa did on sankirtan as being the activities of a ''mundane theif and a robber''?And if so kindly explain how such activities were ''so displeasing to srila Prabhupada'' that he blessed guru-kripa das with a ''cintamani house in the spiritual sky''Yes, I call what Guru-kripa did the activities of a thief, crook, robber, and a criminal. You have been brainwashed by crooks like him in Iskcon into believing that a devotee can do this kind of nonsense and have a 'cintamani house in the spiritual sky'. There is a similar class of brainwashed religious idiots who believe in getting 40 virgins in heaven for killing infidels in their holy war. Sounds familiar? It should, because it is the same propaganda garbage.
sri_govinda_das:....kula-pavanna i call you a paramara....low class...simply looking for stool.Why you fail to see the wonderful good iskcon is doing everyday!I have no problem seeing the wonderful good things happening in Iskcon every day. I also have no problem seeing the bad things that happened in the past or might be happening now. ------------------------- Some devotees have no problem pointing out the faults of other people, but when someone points out THEIR problem, they call them names and accuse them of looking for stool. Such devotees lose all credibility.