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ISKCON and the Organisation led by Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa
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Hare Krishna Everyone,
I know its none of my business, as a person who has never served nor been a member of the worldwide congregation of ISKCON, to ask any questions regarding the internal problems going on between ISKCON and the organization run by Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa that controls the Hare Krishna Hill, Bangalore.
It is very painful to see such a flagship temple severing its ties with the mother organization and so much time, energy and effort being spent which could be otherwise utilized in a good way.
It is also clear that Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa and his organization has started its work on a mega project called Krishna Lila Theme Park on the outskirts of Bangalore. Does ISKCON worldwide know about it?
Will by the grace of God and Guru the temple at Hare Krishna Hill and Krishna Lila Theme Park ever come back to ISKCON worldwide?
I ardently pray to the lotus feet of The Supreme Personality of Godhead that it happens real soon.
Regards
Joyaditta -
makes no difference for the people that benefits from any camp that preaches KC and follows Srila Prabhupada´s simple instructions.
Names are only that, names.
At the end of the day, Krishna controls and utilizes everyone of us, be that realized or not.
If someone feels the imperative need to "belong" to a particular institution to feel validated, that also his/her call. -
Personally having been associated with maha sringha das ,whom was the Temple president there in Bangalore previous to Madhu pandit it is a very interesting scenario.He informs me that though the ritvik -vada team of Madhu pandit stole the temple from Iskcon proper ...the initial problem was that iskcon because it was registered outside India, they were seen as ''American ''...in other words in an unfavourable light!
This has now been rectified by the creation of ...and ground breaking ceremony of the Vedic Planetarium,with ISKCON now formalising there world head quaters in sri dharma mayapura officially!
Because of the real threat of possibly taking other temples,and even setting up another GBC for their own ISKCON...in other words a mirror image of iscon itself.... for india and then eventually for the world the GBC were very keen to put a stop to such extreme activities if possible!..In other words given the ability in India to practically assume a iskcon society position...unchallenged ,create a new GBC...ineffect they could with time possibly be in a position to steal all iskcons assets!
Wonderfully there was some chance made unofficially to work with them making possible compromises ,however it was the indian and russian devotees whom eventually moved against this peace offer refusing to accomadate those whom had previously been within there own ranks!....Personally i agree with mishra sadhu, an all emcompasing scenario needs to be followed again....a more broad minded spectre encouraging honesty ! -
Back in the early 80's bangalore temple was in a small rented housed in Rajaji Nagar. Maha Sringha Das and Satvic Das were running the temple. Later on Madhu Pandit Das (MPD) and Chancalpathi came into picture - they moved it to a bigger rental house and later to the Hare Krishna Hill. MPD team in matter of years built the beautiful temple on the land (rather, useless rock) provided by the Government. This came with lot of hard work - so not sure how we acn say, they "stole the temple from iskcon proper".
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Let me answer to best of my knowledge
>Who brought them in the picture may I ask? Please donot take this question otherwise as I am ignorant about it.
>Was he appointed by GBC?
GBC appointed them as President/VP of Bangalore temple - some time between 84-86
>Isn't it expected from a temple president ?
Yes expanding the congregation and providing temple is temple president's job - building a temple in about 10 years costing Rs 38 Crores is no easy task - if you think that should be the case, why not try to build a temple that is as beautiful as Hare Krishna Hill temple.
>I would guess that Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa came into picture about early 1990's, isnt it?
around 1985-86
>Bangalore started off big on the global stage around that time through IT and ITES.No IT bubble burst or recession at that time.People had money and they could spend it.
Temple was completed by 1997 - way before IT boom
>I suppose he collected donations for the temple. Could I ask what he told when he collected the money in the name of ISKCON?
>Did he mention to the donors that ISKCON they are giving money to is different to ISKCON worldwide? A simple yes or no answer would help.
Bangalore temple was registered as Karnataka entity - this was done by the recommendation of GBC !! and it stays the same way today. Both pre and post madhu pandit days, money collection is done the same way - for Srila Prabhupada's ISKCON
>Someone employs you, you excel in your job and then you try kicking the employer out....... well thats stealing by my books.
i don't understand the comparison here - ISKCON bangalore was a karnaka regisistered entity from day one it was registered. So it has been operating the same way since it was registered.
by the way, i am just a bangalore das - i am not associated with iskcon bangalore in any way - i have just visited iskcon bangalore since the new temple was built one a handful of times - but looking at their accomplishments i am amazed. I am sure they have blessing from Lord Krishna and Srila Prabhudha on every one of there efforts to propagate Sri Krishna's glories. -
a devotee did travel all over USA and saw that the projects that are flourishing are the ones that are not directly under the GBC, mind you, not inimical, just that they are entirely run by devotees in a private way. It is sad, but nonetheless true that if you try to run a new project under the institution it becomes ruined very soon, by a combination of politics and burocracy.
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>Srila Prabhupada's ISKCON
[p]
Any temple Glorifying Srila Prabhudha belongs to Srila Prabhupada - so is Bangalore Temple.
Bangalore temple was registered as Karnataka entity - this was done by how Srila Prabhupada wanted it registered (and how the local GBC recommended) -
>> Someone employs you, you excel in your job and then you try kicking the employer out....... well thats stealing by my books.
>i don't understand the comparison here - ISKCON bangalore was a karnaka regisistered entity from day one it was registered. So it has been operating the same way since it was registered.
ISKCON was designed by SP as decentralized, i.e. in each country registered separately. I don't know if he wanted for India it to be separately registered in each state - someone who knows can tell us.
MPdas built Bangalore temple as the ISKCON temple but then adopted ritvikism and started a legal battle with ISKCON over it since he thinks ritviks are the 'real ISKCON'. What I know from a few devotees living in India is that ritvikism is used there as a cover for personal ambitions of certain individuals who're after profit, control and adoration. Thus they don't take MPdas and other ritviks seriously. -
VEDA> I do not take seriously any person with ulterior selfish plans and that is not a question of names or institutions. Do you think that just by being under the banner of the "official" ISKCON, leaders are sort of immunized?
At the moment there are many more evidences of that what you accuse in there. And I am not ritvik, just have two eyes in my head and a more or less functioning brain.
You are intelligent, do not let yourself be caught in political battles for supremacy, my car is better than yours, etc, but the truth. Brahmana means independent thoughtful man. -
> What I know from a few devotees living in India is that ritvikism is used there as a cover for personal ambitions of certain individuals who're after > profit, control and adoration.
I am not a rtvik either but I got a great education in profit, control and adoration in my 4 years in ISKCON India temples. -
mishra and deena,
I referred to ritviks, not to official ISKCON leaders. From my statement about A one can't make any conclusions about what I think of B.
Tu quoque logical fallacy "A steals. But B steals too!" is quite common but shouldn't be found among devotees, imho, while stealing remains as the problem.
If one puts side by side a ritvik like MPd and a hypothetical corrupt ISKCON leader, then although they may have the same above mentioned motives and both are despicable, the latter is better of the two because he 1. didn't concoct an antivedic philosophy and 2. didn't attribute it to SP to justify his nonsense.
Level of my interest in various organizations's politics: very marginal -
. Yasomatinandana Dasa...my temple president in 1974-80 sydney ...and good freind,hey how come he does not get a temple if madhu pandit does?He was at least a Prabhupada disciple...a real one!...he answered this to gaura hari das on facebook!
Jokes aside, your use of these quotes did nothing raise your grade-point average because your entire argument is underminded by your misunderstanding of Srila Prabhupada's instructions regarding ritviks. There simply was no "written arrangement" validating the ritvik system you propose. I was a ritvik TP - Srila Prabhupada asked me once when he was ill to name a devotee, chant on his beads and conduct the fire ceremony as if I were him - but of course the devotee was Srila Prabhupada's disciple. Srila Prabhupada introduced that ritvik system, which was never meant to continue after he had left us. Because there is no evidence to support the idea that Prabhupada intended the system to continue even past his ill-health at the time, the use of the "sastric quotes" you provide is simply spurious. You have a built in defence that anyone who criticises your concoction is "asslike" or at least not swanlike and narrowminded, but this is contradictory as you are an example of the very critical mentality you criticise, which of course you may now direct at me to undrmine me. Very convenient. It seems that you assume some, if not all, those who bravely accept the position of guru in ISKCON are madhyam or lesser. If you have faith that Prabhupada can be the guru of someone when he is not physically present, then why not simply have faith that even if a disciple is initiated by a "lesser" person according to your estimation, Srila Prabhupada will still guide and protect that devotees disciple. -
It seems that you assume some, if not all, those who bravely accept the position of guru in ISKCON are madhyam or lesser. If you have faith that Prabhupada can be the guru of someone when he is not physically present, then why not simply have faith that even if a disciple is initiated by a "lesser" person according to your estimation, Srila Prabhupada will still guide and protect that devotees disciple. ...The moral of the story..........''so if you collect the laxsmi for iskcon,but it is registered nefariously ...well it pays personally obviously''.Then you have to create a GBC to continue the cheating process ,factually in a humble attempt to make the previous temple activities bonifide....at least to buy time and hence with money hopefully buy the truth by creating a real new reality!
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Is it the process that has been adopted by GBC for all temples now or was Bangalore temple was made an exception.
If it is a process adopted by GBC then how come no other temples in India have come out of ISKCON worldwide. And surely when GBC recommended the same for Bangalore temple it surely it might be due to some technical purpose and not to get itself into a legal battle. I mean why woud someone ask for trouble.
Regards
Joyaditta -
In my humble view, even if that has been some sort of separatism on the part of Bangalore temple, let them do. Why to go on legal battle, that means greed for properties and position.
If GBC has lost control of the Bangalore and other temples, its time they ask themselves, learn form the lesson and correct the cause if possible.
If control is lost, then let it be. Let put all our energies, intelligence and resources in the real business, preaching.
There is not much difference in the practical world if one accepts Srila Prabhupada as siksha or diksha, except for bureaucrats very much concerned about titles, position and power.
These are the same type of people that send their fellow citizens to war for purely political, economic, and strategic purposes, creating an ugly "foe".
Devotees at Bangalore temple are not "enemies". They are devotees like you, with a different approach. Time to wake up. -
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Though GBC is tricked in this case I still ardently pray that a constant soul-searching process is going on in GBC ( which I am sure it is the case) to bring back everything come back to normal.
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I totally agree with you in the preaching part but one of the purposes of ISKCON is :
" To erect for the members, and for society at large, a holy place of transcendental pastimes, dedicated to the personality of Krishna." ( source : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Society_for_Krishna_Consciousness )
So temples are important and losing even one of them does not serve the purpose .
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Never in this whole thread have I ever raised a philosophical issue. This thread is about the dispute over the property on Hare Krishna Hill . Everything that has come after that is just a means to an end for the same.
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The 'War' was started by Sri Madhu Pandit Das and not by GBC. In the response to Sri Madhu Pandit's peace proposal the reply that ISKCON Mumbai gave reads as follows :
' We should be clear and honest about the legal disputes between us. The GBC has never filed any court cases against you. It was always you who filed cases against the GBC and ISKCON.'
( source: http://news.iskcon.com/node/1799 )
I think it should be clear by now who went to the ' war ' for ' purely political, economic, and strategic purposes' .
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Devotees are never enemies.They are as much child to Sri Radha Madhav as I am, even more so.
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Again it a philosophical question that is outside the purview of the thread.
More in the next post.
Regards
Joyaditta -
Joyaditta> Is this really a question or a declaration of intentions.... starting a debate in which you are clearly positioned ?
Ritviks think that its fabulous a temple its not in the GBC´s control and GBC are dismayed. I see only politics here. And to put Srila Prabhupada in the middle as if you knew his mind is.... sad.
Many things could be said about Srila Prabhupada would be upset because GBC´s many huge mistakes like the Eleven Gurus, centralization, hinduization, BBT wages, etc etc. But as nobody can verify what Srila Prabhupada would say, best is to refrain to try to put him in your camp.
You are not interested to include philosophy in this thread because you think you have a case just by common sense, but shastra is and must be in all walks of life to understand things in the proper perspective.
And who are you anyway to restrict philosophy in relation with this problem?
Looks like you have an agenda and its not to discuss the theme, but to state your thoughts in favor of the GBC.
What a sad "question". -
Putting things in the proper perspectuive...i can not see Srila Prabhupada suggesting that one of his temples ...Bangalore should not be haphasardly given away ....to be seperate or outside his society whom he gave his last will and testament to...iskcon !
However please inform me if you feel my suposition is wrong in your experienced opinion mishra prabhu...or should we open a pandoras box here by starting to judge according to our own feelings and moods?..If this is injected into an open forum, ...how should we judge wether a society is truely carring on Srila Prabhupadas service? Now we have ritviks whom amplify the sentiment...we are also serving Srila prabhupada ...though possibly heretics in a classical sense ,they also reverberate the sentiments of the dis-enfranchised element! How to judge the madhu pandit ritvik cause in a nuetral light? -
Nobody has "given away". It has been separated by force. But they have their arguments. ISKCON has being in the middle of many lawsuits all over the world, practically losing them all and spending millions of dollars more cause of false ego than anything else. I know a few cases where if real advancement was there it could be settled in a gentleman way and spare much money and energy, but the ego that "we are ISKCON and automatically divine" has led to much suffering and loss of resources.
It makes me shiver when i read "krishna teme lila park will come back to iskcon" Open your eyes, you are not living in the '70s anymore. There are many vaishnava groups with different philosohical approaches.
If this thread is about the real facts, emotions and personal political stands free, then let it be so. Courts will speak.
But do not try to stop others views all the while you air yours so blatantly. And remember who originated the "question". -
''It has been separated by force'',....This is a very important realisation and valid lesson ,mishra prabhu thank you,also this is the nature of the devotional world we face now! More and more things will be see to be true and valid by this force process,not by a common devotional culture or trial by vox populi.But by the rip and tear of the expert cheating process with which leaders may utilize.....''the ends justifies the means''!
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I am just asking questions to the members of this board regarding the move taken by Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa and his organisation. If you take that as my position, be my guest.
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Pleas re-read my postd , I am never dragged Srila Pabhupada's name in any of my posts.
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Do you think these are the above-mentioned reasons for Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa's leagal battle to seperate him and his organization away from ISKCON worldwide ?
I am ignorant as I might be looking at the wrong webpages. I would be thankful if you direct me to the right links.
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In describing common sense wikipedia says:
"Whatever definition one uses, identifying particular items of knowledge as "common sense" becomes difficult. Philosophers may choose to avoid using the phrase when using precise language. But common sense remains a perennial topic in epistemology and many philosophers make wide use of the concept or at least refer to it."
( source : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_sense )
As we could see that philosophers do use or atleast refer to common sense and the Gaudiya Vaishnav Philosophy is not bereft of it, I think we have a link to Philosophy here as well.
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Has Sri Madhu Pandit Das and his organization understood in proper perspective and are trying to chart their way away from ISKCON worldwide?
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No one at all ! Please feel free to discuss it. I would get a good opportunity to ask yourself and others a lot of questions.
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I am sorry you feel that way. -
I am not GBC partisan neither ritvik, the dichotomy you are trying to enlarge.
I feel you are using this thread to advance your point of view, asking a "question"
... and this is not the spirit of this forum.
I am in the awkward position of being involved in this thread and at the same time an admin here.
I feel this question must be closed... I am asking opinions here. What the other devotees think? -
All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
Hare Krishna Prabhu Mishra,
Thank you for your good replies which are benificial for all. You can certainly close the question, using your own intelligence and authority.
There is actually no dichotomy when His Divine Grace AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada is kept in the prominent position. And more and more devotees are coming to that safe, happy, eternal understanding.
FYI: The Krishna-style amusement park is an idea of Srila Prabhupada's, so let if be done for His satisfaction.
Hare Krishna -
I feel the thread has been started for just propaganda against MP & Bangalore and it shows that devotees have to be careful to not become so influenced by gbc as to become very narrow minded and build up hate to other devotees. I was travelling in India and in Mayapur when I expressed a wish to visit Bangalore temple the once friendly Mayapur authorities became so upset and the hate they have built up came out immediately against MP and Bangalore, and I realised that someone had done a very thorough job of anti MP views. I can understand the gbc have a lot to lose if other temples became like Bangalore but the rank & file devotees should see that and also realise like Mishra says that they are devotees also in Bangalore who are trying to please Srila Prabhupada.
Thanks Mishra for bringing some balance to this thread otherwise it seems just an anti MP exercise. -
Hare Krishna. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
Srila Prabhupada is every jiva's eternal spiritual master based on Sri Guru Tattva; anyone can try to understand this tattva and accept Srila Prabhupada in that spirit. The ritvik idea that Srila Prabhupada is the last in Sri Guru Parampara succession is wrong. The ISKCON idea that gurus should attach souls to themselves and not Srila Prabhupada exclusively is wrong. They both have flaws and yet balance each other. When the rank and file devotees begin to understand Sri Guru Tattva, all things will be beautifully clean and auspicious. How long it takes is up to us, individually and collectively. -
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Please feel free to close this thread if it makes you feel awkward.
It's just that you feel awkward when a lay person asks you questions based on common sense, makes me sad and amused at the same time.
Since you are the 'admin' you can execute your powers so go ahead.
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How about believing Paul the "psychic" octopus then?
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Please do indulge me and visit the Hare Krishna Hill as a layman and ask these questions to the devotees there. The propoganda of hatered against the GBC that those people are being fed on can rival North Korea' s propoganda against the US.
As it has been a personal experience and I have not recorded any comments so I couldnot provide any active link. All I can ask you to do is to visit the temple and carry out the research yourself.
Yet to give you an instance of the ' high spirits' there, I quote from this article :
(source :http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/01-09/editorials3891.htm )
" My biggest concern was with Nimai Pandit (who is in Bangalore now) and his Western friends (henchmen?). They made several statements which concerned me deeply and ultimately led me to the decision to leave the ISKCON Bangalore temple. That was, that specifically Mahapurush das and Chaitanya Simha told me that they had told Nimai Pandit when they arrived at ISKCON Bangalore that they were willing to "take out the whole ISKCON GBC", and specifically "Jayapataka Maharaja and Radhanatha Swami." They made statements about killing them. I found this to be extremely troubling and Nimai Pandit did not condemn it at all. In fact, he seemed to only encourage that type of talk and behavior. "
So , did the authorities in Mayapur tell that they were hatching a plot to kill Sri Madhu Pandit Das?
If they have, please let me know as this is definitely the mood in the camp of Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa.
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Please go through my previous posts about the devotees.
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I have quoted from articles from the internet which is open for everyone to see. I have absolutely no personal tussle with the gentleman and his organization.
Yet, if I am not blinded by the charisma and somehow point out something else which is not so good-looking about the person published by the newspapers and not concocted by me, why is it an anti MP exercise?
In my opening post I mentioned :
" It is very painful to see such a flagship temple severing its ties with the mother organization and so much time, energy and effort being spent which could be otherwise utilized in a good way."
Yes, it does pain me to look at the state of affairs in the temple and have started to ask questions so that I could be clear about it.
I have not seen one point-to-point answers to my questions and what's more, there is an attempt to close down the thread.
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Such a profound understanding.
Please do the needful that your 'admin' position urges you to do.
Please go through the posts again and think. It might be a tough call but please do indulge me.
Regards
Joyaditta -
>Do you think these are the above-mentioned reasons for Sri Madhu Pandit Dasa's leagal battle to seperate him and his organization away from ISKCON worldwide ?
Looks like you have lots of questions and you can get answer directly from the source http://struggle-for-truth.org/ at the bottom of the page there is Contact Address.
Misra-ji,
(I will proudly steal the line from maah!) Thank you for your good replies which are benificial for all. You can certainly close the question, using your own intelligence and authority. -
Obviously, this is not a question. Please Joyaditta reads the rules.
The are many places on the Internet to advance and aerate your concerns but this is not the spirit of this site.
People tends to think that because pariprashnena.com is on the Internet can be used for anything, but this was never meant to be a propaganda instrument, not even veiled propaganda.
I hope you will understand our position, and from now on, please use this site to ask what you do not know in the spirit of pariprashnena. -
I feel this question must be closed... I am asking opinions here. What the other devotees think?mishra:
While I don't consider myself a devotee, I take an interest in those who apporach ISKCON and devotees.[br]
[br]So I think, based on the other threads he has started, that Joyaditta is someone who has some interest in getting closer to ISKCON and the devotees, and is showing this in a perhaps indirect manner; someone who wishes to know what all this is about and therefore asks some perhaps less obvious questions but which imply numerous other questions and issues.[br][br]
Some people, upon first learning about devotees, ask questions like "Why do you shave your heads?" or "Why do men wear skirts?". Some other people are interested in perhaps not so obvious things, or things that are considered "advanced". Myself, for example, my first concern was ISKCON's position on the original Fall and the nature of free will, but this was not met with welcome, as these are supposedly "advanced topics" that I should concern myself with only after I have successfully been a devotee for some considerable period of time.[br][br]
I don't think Joyaditta is trying to promote his position. I think he is coming from a significantly different perspective than the "average devotee aspirant". -
> The ISKCON idea that gurus should attach souls to themselves and not Srila Prabhupada exclusively is wrong.
This is not ISKCON idea but a misrepresentation. Guru parampara is not about 'attaching souls' to the guru, rather guru serves as a transparent medium all the way to Krsna.
> When the rank and file devotees begin to understand Sri Guru Tattva, all things will be beautifully clean and auspicious.
Understanding of Sri Guru Tattva goes deeper than we can delve. Our understanding will be always shallow.
Re the thread: We got both sides represented here, actually more from the pro-ritvik side, already amply discussed here, imho. One can call them both propaganda since it's touchy political issue. If we wish to keep this site for philosophical and practical questions, questioners with this type of issues should be referred elsewhere. -
I am not doubting the sincerity of the person or the right or wrong of his contention, but the valid approach. Imagine that everyone comes here with a "question" grounded in a preconceived answer just to start a debate to prove his point.
This kind of "questions" have been identified in the past here and as VEDA says referred elsewhere. -
I am not doubting the sincerity of the person or the right or wrong of his contention, but the valid approach. Imagine that everyone comes here with a "question" grounded in a preconceived answer just to start a debate to prove his point.mishra:
This kind of "questions" have been identified in the past here and as VEDA says referred elsewhere.
I simply do not see this OP question was such a false question.[br][br]
I understood it to ask for an official statement by ISKCON on the temple in question and further temples and other facilities in a similar situation.[br]
[br]
If anything, it appears the OP question was by some posters interpreted as a false question, after which both sides got defensive and things deteriorated from there - which is no surprise.[br][br]
While the OP could simply be responded to by providing a reference to the requested ISKCON document, with little or no further discussion being necessary (and little or no hot blood).[br][br] -
Having read this recent article prabhu submitted by joyaditta ...though you are personally involved mishra prabhu ,i sense you are genuinely mature enough to perceive things from a detached position .I welcome your personal veiws ...though they are different than my own .I feel blessed to have been witness to your siksa and have tried to assimulate your valid realisations.I personally do not feel this thread is in any threatening or off the track ..It seems essential for all of us to appreciate the blossoming of a possible ''christianity like'' break away movement! Sastrically inept but a vitalising group non-the less for those who share there hopes and appreciations....Thank you for allowing me this small opportunity to share...
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Here is the distinction.Ritvic philosophy is wrong but lot more right than that of the GBC's.They glorify Srila Prabhupada at every step and our Iskcon leaders like Radhanath can't even mention their spiritual master even once when interviewed on the FOX channel recently(see it on you tube).I suppose he was too busy with shameless self-promotion and shaking hands with the lady that he completely forgot to mention Srila Prabhupada and his books.That is the difference between Ritvik and GBC.
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Interesting video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WHzy3UephU
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qnFy8ljQiI&feature=related -
> Ritvic philosophy is wrong but lot more right than that of the GBC's.
Just the opposite. If someone doesn't mention his guru, that's between him and his guru. (I saw a verse that one shouldn't reveal in public one's mantra and one's guru's name but don't remember the source. Anyone?)
Otoh, heresy is like a cancer, affecting the whole society. -
I have listened to some of Radhanath Swami lectures, and what caught my attention the most was the way he reverentially spoke Srila Prabhupada's name, each time.
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I have listened to some of Radhanath Swami lectures, and what caught my attention the most was the way he reverentially spoke Srila Prabhupada's name, each time.Baker:
So did Harikesa,Satsvarupa,Jayatirta,Vipramukhya,Jayadvaita,Jagadisha and every darn superstar "guru" in ISKCON and each and every of their sleazy salaried "brahmana" minions .Have you not heard of these "stalwart" "dedicated" "humble""exemplary" "vaishnavas" yet ?
I can forward you some classes etc. if you will allow the history to teach you something Baker.
Don't be mislead.Snake can chant Hare Krishna but the venom remains.I hope and pray you don't get bit.
humbly
jd -
I have also heard that Radhanatha spent millions of Srila Prabhupada's money on fighting with other devotees for power in courts.I have also heard that he ordered the murder of Sulachana.I have also heard about many many other suspicious things looming over his head such as sex scandals.I have also seen how he put Srila Prabhupada on the bottom of the list of his many gurus on his website.(see it for yourself)I have also never even once heard him utter the name of his spiritual master on the public television during his shameless self-promotional appearances.Clearly talking about his Jewish birth was more important to hear about for millions that were watching. He obviously uses his spiritual masters name and fame when and where it matters to him in his relentless pursuit of power.
In the words of one truly dedicated Srila Prabhupada's disciple(stated after he watched Radhanatha chanting japa in public with excruciating facial expression that employed just about every facial muscle available to man ):"I never knew that it takes so many facial muscles to chant the maha mantra sincerely".
I would add.It takes very few facial muscles to impress upon the Lord that you are sincere in your japa, but to get the money from braying materialistic asses you better use all the facial muscles you've got.Just to make sure to get every last penny out of them and perhaps more.
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In this Discussion
- admin November 2010
- Baker November 2010
- bangalore_das July 2010
- bhakti das July 2010
- deena July 2010
- jagannath November 2010
- joyaditta November 2010
- kes July 2010
- maah! July 2010
- manasi_seva November 2010
- mishra July 2010
- mokarda July 2010
- VEDA November 2010