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Social: How to make someone believe that Krishna is the supreme?

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    If he is showing interest but is lacking belief because there is no spiritual knowledge.
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      CommentAuthorVEDA
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2009 edited
     
    Knowledge is superior to belief.

    He is the Only One who bears the names of all Gods (Rig Veda Samhita 10.82.3)

    etena sarve vyAkhyAtA vyAkhyAtAH - All names are names of the Lord. (Vedanta sutra 1.4.28)

    carAcara-vyapAzrayas tu syAt tad-vyapadezo 'bhAktas tad-bhAva-bhAvitvAt - All words indeed primarily indicate the Supreme Lord. But this is known only to one who has realized the full truth of the Vedanta. (Vs. 2.3.15)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svayam_bhagavan
    • CommentAuthorBaker
    • CommentTimeOct 5th 2009
     
    VEDA:Knowledge is superior to belief.
    Given the dichotomy above, would it be correct to say that jnana (in the sense of "book knowledge, theoretical knowledge") is belief, while vijnana is knowledge?
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      CommentAuthorVEDA
    • CommentTimeOct 5th 2009
     
    Regarding mundane knowledge I'd agree.

    Theoretical knowledge of sastra is more of a trust than a belief. Trust in guru, sadhu and sastra who confirm this knowledge even before one realized it. Vijnana can be also called wisdom.

    Srila Prabhupada in Raja vidya 1 makes this difference: "Whatever knowledge we receive from Bhagavad-gita should not be taken for sentimentality or fanaticism. The knowledge is both jnana and vijnana, theoretical wisdom and scientific knowledge."
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      CommentAuthormaah!
    • CommentTimeOct 7th 2009
     
    "How to make someone believe that Krishna is the supreme?"

    If they are willing to read Srila Prabhupada's books, just read with them or give them Sri Isopanishad and Srimad Bhagavad Gita As It Is Original Edition. Srila Prabhupada is the jagat guru and if the soul is serious, He will educate them from without and within.

    Trying to make them believe may not be as effective as asking for this:

    ""Lord Sri Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, at least theoretically, according to the statements of Bhagavad-gita or the statements of Arjuna, the person who is trying to understand the Bhagavad-gita. We should therefore at least theoretically accept Sri Krsna as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and with that submissive spirit we can understand the Bhagavad-gita. Unless one reads the Bhagavad-gita in a submissive spirit, it is very difficult to understand Bhagavad-gita because it is a great mystery.""

    They may not be willing to step into the unknown, Srila Prabhupada, the brilliant Jagat Guru, Yuga Dharma Acarya started with what we did know. And focused on "You are not that body." So you can put emphasis on the necessity of Srimad Bhagavad Gita:

    ""Just what is the Bhagavad-gita? The purpose of Bhagavad-gita is to deliver mankind from the nescience of material existence. Every man is in difficulty in so many ways, as Arjuna also was in difficulty in having to fight the Battle of Kuruksetra. Arjuna surrendered unto Sri Krsna, and consequently this Bhagavad-gita was spoken. Not only Arjuna, but every one of us is full of anxieties because of this material existence. Our very existence is in the atmosphere of nonexistence. Actually we are not meant to be threatened by nonexistence. Our existence is eternal. But somehow or other we are put into asat. Asat refers to that which does not exist. "" Introduction to Srimad Bhagavad Gita As It Is. AsItIs.com

    "would it be correct to say that jnana (in the sense of "book knowledge, theoretical knowledge") is belief, while vijnana is knowledge?" Baker

    After you accept and follow knowledge, jnana, you get the result or direct experience, vijana. Real jnana is perfect knowiedge. Srimad Bhagavad Gita As It Is original edition by His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada created so many devotees in the west from people who never heard of Lord Krishna before. From Lord Krishna they got the perfect jnana then they followed it and realize Sri Krishna as the Supreme. It has that power.
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      CommentAuthormaah!
    • CommentTimeOct 7th 2009
     
    ""The Vedas are not compilations of human knowledge. Vedic knowledge comes from the spiritual world, from Lord Krsna. Another name for the Vedas is shruti. Shruti refers to that knowledge which is acquired by hearing. It is not experimental knowledge. Shruti is considered to be like a mother. We take so much knowledge from our mother. For example, if you want to know who your father is, who can answer you? Your mother.
    If the mother says, “Here is your father,” you have to accept it. It is not possible to experiment to find out whether he is your father. Similarly, if you want to know something beyond your experience, beyond your experimental knowledge, beyond the activities of the senses, then you have to accept the Vedas. There is no question of experimenting. It has already been experimented. It is already settled. The version of the mother, for instance, has to be accepted as truth. There is no other way.""

    ""There are three kinds of evidence: pratyaksha, anumana and sabda. Pratyaksha means "direct evidence." Direct evidence is not very good because our senses are not perfect. We are seeing the sun daily, and it appears to us just like a small disc, but it is actually far, far larger than many planets. Of what value is this seeing? Therefore we have to read books; then we can understand about the sun. So direct experience is not perfect. Then there is anumana, inductive knowledge: "It may be like this"-hypothesis. For instance, Darwin's theory says it may be like this, it may be like that. But that is not science. That is a suggestion, and it is also not perfect. But if you receive the knowledge from the authoritative sources, that is perfect. If you receive a program guide from the radio station authorities, you accept it. You don't deny it; you don't have to make an experiment, because it is received from the authoritative sources.""

    ""Since the Vedic knowledge is pure, we accept it. Whatever Krishna says, we accept. This is Krishna consciousness. That saves much time
    • CommentAuthorBaker
    • CommentTimeOct 9th 2009
     
    "How to make someone believe that Krishna is the supreme?"

    What is meant here by "believe"?

    The word "believe" (and "belief") can be used to mean so many things.
    On the one hand, it can be used to mean something in a strictly cognitive sense, e.g. "I believe there is a book in the drawer, because I myself put it there just before".
    On the other hand, it can be used to mean something in a more ethical/moral sense, 'to have faith, to value positively, to treasure', e.g. "I think you are a good person, and that you will succeed in life. I believe in you."
    And then it can be used to mean something inbetween, or a conflation of more meanings.
    In conversation, it's important for each party to know what the other party means by words like "truth", "knowledge", "belief".


    Also, I think more information is needed to address the OP topic. Is the other person, for example, a Christian, who believes that Jehowah is the Supreme but who also has some interest in Krishna? Or is the person a declared atheist? Is the person simply undecided? Many different kinds of people may have an interest in Krishna.
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      CommentAuthorccd
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2009 edited
     
    One just needs to accept that Lord Caitanya is the Supreme, just accept it! Worship of Visnu or following the Vedas is not sufficient to one NOT being a demon...

    purve yaiche jarasandha-adi raja-gana
    veda-dharma kari' kare visnura pujana

    Formerly kings like Jarasandha [the father-in-law of Kamsa] strictly followed the Vedic rituals, thus worshiping Lord Visnu.


    krsna nahi mane, tate daitya kari' mani
    caitanya na manile taiche daitya tare jani

    One who does not accept Krsna as the Supreme Personality of Godhead is certainly a demon. Similarly, anyone who does not accept Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu as Krsna, the same Supreme Lord, is also to be considered a demon.
    • CommentAuthorBaker
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2009
     
    ccd:One just needs to accept that Lord Caitanya is the Supreme, just accept it!
    What does "accept" mean here?
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      CommentAuthorccd
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2009
     
    Baker:
    ccd:One just needs to accept that Lord Caitanya is the Supreme, just accept it!
    What does "accept" mean here?
    It means start rendeing service, by offering obeisances, favorable hearing and chanting, remembering and surrendering yourself. To what degree you do it is of course a question.
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      CommentAuthorccd
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2009
     
    ccd:
    Baker:
    ccd:One just needs to accept that Lord Caitanya is the Supreme, just accept it!
    What does "accept" mean here?
    It means start rendeing service, by offering obeisances, favorable hearing and chanting, remembering and surrendering yourself. To what degree you do it is of course a question.
    It is a gradual process and you will get more and more as you actually do it. Not that to anyone who challeges God, He will reveal Himself with a saksad-darsana.
    • CommentAuthorBaker
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2009
     
    I had the impression so far that "accept" implies complete/perfect surrender; that it is an all-or-nothing, with no issues of degree.
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      CommentAuthorccd
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2009 edited
     
    Baker:I had the impression so far that "accept" implies complete/perfect surrender; that it is an all-or-nothing, with no issues of degree.
    The surrendered soul must accept the fact that his real protector is Krsna, not his material acquisitions. Submission to guru is unquestionable, after the acceptance. But you can not expect to have achieved perfect realisation and understanding of Krishna. It will remain weak and some 'potential' for anarthas remain even at prema stage. So anarthas will remain until you actually meet the divine couple face to face by the grace of Srila Prabhupada. That is 'perfect surrender'. Anything before that is not perfect, and even at that stage, watch for pride;-) that is yet another reason why we wish to always remain servants of the servants...

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